THE EVENING BEE: FRIDAY, OCTOBER 15, 1897.
PROOF OF CHARGES AGAINST GERALDINE
Stenographic Report of the Testimony Taken by the Investigating Committee.
Following will be found a continuation of the testimony taken by the special committee which investigated the charges of corruption and collusion made against Dion Geraldine, superintendent of construction of the Transmississippi and International Exposition. In yesterday's issue was printed the testimony leading up to the admission by Geraldine that he had changed the specifications for the sheet piling at the lagoon. What followed here is given:
Kountze—I think there is a charge here that the specifications called for white pine.
Geraldine—Yes. And that in letting the contract preference was given to yellow pine, which was, according to the charge, a lower priced material.
Was that correct, that the specifications called for white pine?
BY AN OVERSIGHT.
Geraldine—The specifications called for white pine. The blanks for bidding submitted called for a bid on both yellow and white pine. If you will look over the bods you will notice that is called for in all cases. By the time the bids were received I had carried the investigation to that point and the summary of the bids that is given here and elsewhere was made entirely upon yellow pine, because at that time the qustion of yellow pine had entirely disappeared. By an oversight it was still left in the specifications and copied.
Kountze—But all the contractors had the information that they might bid either with yellow or white pine?
Geraldine—Yes, sir, and their bids are there on both kinds.
Rosewater—Are these the bids of the lumber dealers?
Geraldine—No, sir; the contractors.
Rosewater—Am I permitted to ask some questions as we go along here?
Kountze—I presume so, so long as you don't break in.
Geraldine—He has my full consent if he doesn't take too much time.
Rosewater—I simply want to know at what date these lumber bids were made or asked for?
Geraldine—The time of these bids, this yellow pine bid, was the 15th of July, I think—the 16th of July.
Rosewater—Why were these bids not submitted to the board—the bids for lumber?
Geraldine—Why were these bids for lumber not submitted to the board? Because it was not called for, and there was nothing to require it.
Rosewater—You said that you made a purchase. At what price did you buy this yellow pine and how many thousand feet did you buy?
Geraldine—The price of yellow pine purchased was $14.50.
Rosewater—And you thought at that time that that was $1.50 lower than you could buy it at any other place, from any other dealer?
Geraldine—I thought so.
Rosewater—Didn't you know that you could buy lumber at that time a dollar cheaper than $14?
Geraldine—These bids explain that.
Rosewater—Why did you not report this purchase—the quality, quantity and price—to the board at any time?
Geraldine—Mr. Kountze, I think these matters have been fully explained. There was no call for reporting all this. These bids were taken for information, not knowing whether we would be called upon to buy the lumber or not. When the bids were opened and found to be too high I then suggested that we purchase the lumber and have these bids as my authority as to where to go for it. The lumber was purchased on the 24th.
Why was not the contract or the order for that lumber filed with the secretary for the information of this board?
Geraldine—I was never instructed to file that order.
Rosewater—And you knew how many thousand feet you turned over to Creedon & Mahoney? How many?
HIS MEMORY DEFECTIVE.
Geraldine—I don't recollect.
Rosewater—You don't know how much lumber you bought?
Geraldine—I don't know exactly. My memory is not quite as retentive as that on all the details. The lumber that I ordered was somewhere, I think, about 170,000 feet.
Kountze—I presume the office has a record of the quantity of lumber that was purchased?
Rosewater—We have no such record here with the secretary. Have you ever heard how much was bought there?
Geraldine—There was never any occasion to turn any order over, because the order in a few days was turned over to the contractor and he assumed it. That is, the contractor paid the lumberman.
Rosewater—At what price?
Geraldine—At the price that I ordered it at—$14.50—$1 higher than I could buy it at the common size and common quality. This quality was the highest quality obtainable. It was sawed a quarter of an inch thicker than the ordinary size and tongued and grooved on a special design, for which the mill had to make their knives. For these reasons, in order to get the requisite thickness and quality, I agreed to pay $1 higher per thousand. Have I made that clear?
Kountze—The lumber that was furnished was of a higher grade than the lumber that these bids were put in on?
Geraldine—Yes, sir.
Rosewater—Didn't you say to Mr. Kirkendall that you were saving the exposition from $200 to $300 on this deal because the lumber was $1.50 cheaper than it could be bought for from any other dealer?
Geraldine—No.
Rosewater—We will let you settle that with Mr. Kirkendall.
Bidwell—As I understand it, the lumber which you purchased was one-quarter inch over stock size, so that it would dress down a full three inches. And this lumber which you bought, was that some which was manufactured for this purpose?
Geraldine—Specially.
Bidwell—Wasn't anything you found in stock?
Geraldine—No, sir, it was ordered from the timber.
Bidwell—I can understand readily how an extra thickness in the lumber would cost more, Mr. Rosewater, than stock size.
Rosewater—But we were assured that we were getting a great bargain in buying this lumber cheaper than anybody would sell it for, and we were never taken into the confidence of Mr. Geraldine as to how much he bought, at what price he bought it or how much he turned over.
Kountze—You said about $3,000?
Geraldine—That is about what it was. That is the approximate amount.
Kountze—As I understand it the association, as an association, never actually bought this lumber, never paid for it?
Geraldine—No, sir.
Kountze—The contractor simply stepped in and took the contract which you had the option upon?
Geraldine—Which I had already ordered at the time the contract was made and which was supposed to be under way.
Kountze—And he stepped in and took it off the association's hands at the same price at which you had contracted for it?
Geraldine—Yes.
Kountze—And which the association would have paid had they taken the lumber?
Geraldine—Yes.
Wells—And you submitted that proposition to turn over this lumber to only one of those bidders?
ONLY ONE BIDDER.
Geraldine—Yes, sir, only one, because it was not made until the final proposition. I was not foolish enough to tell those contractors that we had ordered the lumber and put myself in that position. The question was asked here some time ago. Now, after these bids were rejected, I was surprised to find them so high; supposed it could be done for less. I wanted to place it under contract. I went over the specifications and drawings carefully to see if I could cut out any expense here or there. I conferred with as good authorities as I could find on that class of work and I made some changes. It is not customary in letting contracts to reject bids and ask for bids again on exactly the same specifications, because I contractor is not expected to alter his bid under such circumstances unless a change is made. It is customary in such cases to call the lowest bidders. In this case the two lowest bidders were Connolly and Creedon & Mahoney. Connolly was the lowest bidder, having bid $7,900 on the entire job, as you will see by his original proposition. There was another bidder, the third, Mr. Raymond. I also called him in. If you please, I will read what I dictated here. (Reads.)
Now, it has been stated that Mr. Connolly turned in a proposition to do the work for $7,100. That statement is absolutely untrue. Here is his proposition. Here are all the propositions he has ever offered. It is stated here that he turned in a proposition to do the labor for $2,100. That is also untrue. I will read his proposition. (Reads proposition.) I explained to Mr. Connolly the changes that we made of changing the connection between the mainstay piles and the anchor piles to wire cables instead of stringers and of sinking a ditch one foot to be filled with clay and tamped and drive the sheet piling six inches.
Wells—By what authority did you change those specifications?
Geraldine—By the same authority by which I made them. I was authorized to do that work by Mr. Kirkendall. That is what I am supposed to be here for.
Kountze—All the bidders were aware of the changes in the specifications?
Geraldine—The three lowest bidders. The bids received were: Hamilton Brothers, $11,542; A. A. Raymond, $8,724.38; Creedon & Mahoney, $8,161.10; James P. Connolly, $7,900.
Rosewater—That is on the first proposition?
Geraldine—Yes.
Rosewater—He says that this is false, that Connolly bid $7,100 for this work, and that it is false that he bid $2,100 for the labor. Isn't it true that in his bid, on the face of it, you say that he offered to deduct $700 if he were allowed to do what you allowed Mr. Creedon to do?
Geraldine—That is not true.
Rosewater—You read it there?
Geraldine—It is not there. The modification we proposed for setting the piling in the ground was to sink a ditch one foot and drive the piling six inches, the idea being that by driving six inches we could get probably as good a job as by driving a greater depth. I also decided that instead of sharpening the piles as shown here, to sharpen them on the side so that they would form a wedge on the sides.
Rosewater—Who made these plans?
Geraldine—I must ask, Mr. Kountze, that this gentleman be required to sit down and wait until I get through.
Kountze—I think that Mr. Geraldine should have the right to make an explanation.
Geraldine—I explained that these plans were drawn by Thomas Shaw, Mr. Connolly suggested that instead of driving at all, if I would relieve him from doing any driving that he could put the piling in a ditch and fill it up so that it would hold water. I didn't think so, and told him I couldn't consider it. When he put in this bid, "if sheet piling is allowed to be set in a trench instead of being driven, deduct $700," it was on the proposition to do no driving at all, which we could not consider, and I distinctly told him so. He then said he could make no deduction on that score and his bid stands at $7,800, and he refused to do it for anything less. I had asked him the same as the others, to submit a proposition for the work, and for all the materials and the work, or for such portion of the materials as he could furnish to the best advantage. This was his proposition. There is the proposition I received from Creedon & Mahoney. (Reads.) After receiving that proposition from Mr. Creedon, I asked him what price he had figured on lumber. He said he had figured $13.50. I asked him if he could buy lumber of the quality called for. He insisted that he could; that he could get a good quality at that if he could have time to get it here. I then explained to him that I had ordered the lumber, explained the specifications under which it was ordered, the degree of thickness, the better quality and the special design of the tongue and groove, and asked if he would be willing to take that order off our hands at that price and still do the work at the figure he had made. He said he wanted time to consider that, went away, came back, and finally said he would do so. I then reported this matter to the manager of my department and recommended that the contract be given to Creedon & Mahoney at the figures named and under these conditions, and that the piling be let as a separate contract or done by ourselves. I explained that the lowest figure I could obtain was 5 cents per foot for driving the piling and the other prices mentioned for driving the sheet piling. Mr. Kirkendall asked me if I could do it for a less figure. I told him I thought we could. As a result of the conference I recommended that we do the piling ourselves, the contract to be let to Creedon & Mahoney. It went to the executive committee. There was some criticism offered on the specifications. It was on the day that Mr. Kirkendall left the city, I think. Mr. Rosewater and Mr. Lindsay came to my office to get the specifications. The criticism was offered, to which I replied and asked for a suggestion of something better, which was never offered. Later the same proposition was presented to the executive committee by the president, who, in the absence of Mr. Kirkendall, acted as manager of this department. I was called before the committee in regard to the matter, I was asked numerous questions in regard to it and explained every detail as far as was required. Mr. Rosewater was present and asked some questions about it; asked me in regard to the cement mentioned and other questions. I don't remember just what. But I do remember that I explained all this matter, much of which I am explaining now. In my presence the executive committee voted unanimously to award the contract to Creedon & Mahoney, and instructed the acting manager to do the rest of the work ourselves. I immediately proceeded with it.
Kountze—May I ask you—The cement was omitted in doing the work? Had the cement been used, would it have added to the cost of doing the work?
Geraldine—No, sir.
Kountze—The puddling of the trench cost the contractor as much as it would have cost him had he used the cement?
Geraldine—Yes, it cost him more.
Kountze—And the work without the cement is preferable to that with the cement?
WAS SOMEWHAT UNCERTAIN.
Geraldine—Yes, sir; I believe that it is. At the time I drew those specifications I was somewhat uncertain about the matter and thought that possibly the use of a small amount of cement there might aid in some cases. I
was fearful of finding decomposed strata of clay or porous material that would not puddle. In that case I also wanted to make a joint inside the sheet piling through this strata if I found it. There was one stratum of that material found higher up in the clay which made me apprehensive of finding more. I might explain that further. Here is the contract of Creedon & Mahoney. (Reads from contract.) You will observe that I state that the ditch shall not be more than five inches in width, the idea being that the narrower we made the ditch, without disturbing the clay at the bottom of the ditch, the better joint we could make. This ditch being five inches wide, the plank would fill three inches, leaving only two inches to be filled. I thought that possibly to fill the balance of that with American cement might be better than undertaking to tamp it. I found on more careful examination of the clay that it is what is called joint clay; that is, porous, having perpendicular pores; that to break those pores it was better to do it by puddling it and tamping it. Now, you will readily understand that if that ditch, two inches wide and only a foot deep, was to be filled with cement it would only require a small quantity of cement. The cement was never intended to apply in any place except where I might find decomposed material. The facts are that this ditch was dug a foot wide. I found that in going on with the work, testing it, that a better job could be obtained by digging a ditch wider, puddling it and tamping, which was done.
Bidwell—Was there any extra charge on the part of the contractor for that?
Geraldine—He was not allowed any.
Bidwell—Did he ask any?
Geraldine—He did and it was refused.
Bidwell—Was it refused before or after he did the work? Did he make his claim before he did the work.
Geraldine—He made it afterward. Is that matter of the cement satisfactorily disposed of?
Kountze—I think it is explained in a manner that is intelligently understood by the committee.
Geraldine—Are there any questions to be asked about it? It seems to be made a point in these charges. I should be glad to answer them.
Kountze—I think the question was asked whether the cost of doing it one way or doing it the other, which was the cheaper, whether there was any difference in the cost. And I think the answer was that the tamping cost more than putting in the cement. Is that correct?
Geraldine—Yes, sir. The work as done, in digging the ditch wider and tamping it thoroughly, as was done, is more expensive than putting in the cement. And the cement was never contemplated except in such places as might be found porous and might be put in as a safeguard.
FIGURING THE COST.
Kountze—I think it might be well perhaps to state to the committee what would have been the probable cost and quantity of cement that would have been required to have done the work if it had been done with cement instead of clay.
Geraldine—Well, the quantity of cement contemplated, the difficulties contemplated in encountering any of these stratas could not have exceeded more than $30 worth of cement in the entire job, under the worst conditions that we expected or anticipated. Now, as to any preference being shown these bidders. If any preference at all was shown it was in favor of Mr. Connolly. As to the cost of the entire job, there is a statement taken from our books showing the cost of the sheet piling.
Kountze—I understand, Mr. Geraldine, that on the question of these specifications you stated you drew them and you changed them. Or, they were drawn by Mr. Shaw under your direction and changed by you?
Geraldine—Yes, sir. And here are the changes put on. I have something to say in regard to Mr. Shaw.
Kountze—Were you authorized to change the plans or specifications on any work of this kind?
Geraldine—Yes.
Wells—Do you mean previous to the letting of this contract? For instance, here may be an architect or a landscape engineer engaged for a building or the laying out of grounds, etc. Now, what I wanted to understand was, whether, after these plans had been made by an architect for a building or a landscape engineer in the laying out of grounds, as the case may be, had Mr. Geraldine the right or authority to change this in any manner?
Geraldine—The changes made were submitted with the revised, the later propositions and the recommendation to let the contract, in the same manner in which the first drawings were presented, and the authority granted by the executive committee, the order given by them, referred to them the same as to the other proposition.
Rosewater—Did you re-advertise the whole of this matter? Did all these contractors have an opportunity to enter?
GROWS QUITE INSULTING.
Geraldine—I have answered that question two or three times here, and unless Mr. Kountze desires it—
Rosewater—I want to tell you that I am one of the managers of this concern, as well as one of the men who bring these charges. You are one of our employes, and I am not to be insulted by being told that I am some side-show fellow, like some cheap lawyer. I want the question answered so that for your own benefit you will have the opportunity to clear yourself.
Geraldine—I thank you that you are so much interested in my welfare, Mr. Rosewater.
Rosewater—If you did not advertise the plans to the bidders, how did they know there was to be any bidding? He stated that all of them were notified verbally to come and see these specifications. I have had conversations with one of the bidders (I haven't seen Creedon & Mahoney), and he may have lied to me. He stated to me that several changes were made, of which he knew nothing, and he certainly knew nothing of this lumber being changed. Now, I asked him as to the plans, for reasons. Mr. Shaw drew those plans. He is a civil engineer and is thoroughly competent to draw them. They have been radically changed, and not for the better. Now, what I wanted to ask is this: Why was it that the pile driving was done by the exposition rather than to leave it to any contractor under specifications that would require a fixed quality of work? I do not know whether you want to answer that question or not, but it seems to me it is a very important one, because I will follow it up with another question. Is it not true that in your office you have an employe and clerk who is drawing $75 a month who owns that pile driver and is doing pile driving on the grounds and is in partnership with another employe?
Geraldine—No, that is not true.
Rosewater—Well, we will prove it before we get through. Mr. Templeton does not make any secret of the fact that he owns that pile driver, does he?
Geraldine—I know that he does own the pile driver.
Rosewater—And that he does the work on the grounds. Isn't that true?
Geraldine—No, that is not true that I know of.
Rosewater—Who does it, then?
Geraldine—This work was done by our own employes entirely.
Rosewater—What does Mr. Templeton do, then, with his pile driver?
Geraldine—Would you like to have that explained.
Kountze—I think, as Mr. Rosewater has raised the question, it might be well to explain it.
Rosewater—I think Mr. Geraldine has said that the pile driving was undertaken on the part of the exposition because he found that the exposition could do it for a less amount than that which was called for on the bid of the contractors. In what way was this purchase of piles made, on contracts?
Geraldine—The piles were bought.
Rosewater—Did you make contracts for them?
Geraldine—I gave verbal order for them.
Rosewater—A verbal order?
Geraldine—In some cases a written order, as the case may be. I would like to explain that question also, as it has been raised. When it was found that Creedon & Mahoney made this low proposition, as before stated, and as you will find written in this statement, I asked the next man, A. A. Raymond, who was about the only regular pile driver who had appeared up to this time, to make a figure for driving the piles. He asked 5 cents a foot for driving the mainstay and backstay piles.
Rosewater—Does that mean furnishing the timber?
THE PILE DRIVER DEAL.
Geraldine—No, we were to furnish the timber. I thought we could do it cheaper as we had formerly been doing some pile driving on the grounds and had hired a pile driver of Mr. Raymond. After deciding to do so I looked for a pile driver to rent and using his in driving the piles for the Manufactures building. In making inquiries I learned from Mr. Templeton, one of the employes, that he had the greater part of a pile driver and owned the principal part of the machine. I asked what he would let the exposition have it for and he replied that if we would take it and fix it up, pay for whatever was necessary to make it run, that we could have the use of it for nothing. Or he would fix it up and rent it to us complete, as a first class machine for about $7 a day. I had the work done.
Bidwell—Did that include the engine?
Geraldine—Included everything. I had the work done and the cost of the pile driver on this job, or of repairing it, amounted to somewhere in the vicinity of $80. I do not remember just what, but can get it from the books. It is included, however, in the items given here. After finishing the work and turning over the machinery to Mr. Templeton what he has done with it is not a matter for me to be interested in. I understand that he turned the pile driver over to a man named Green and he has been bidding on the pile driving since. What is Mr. Templeton's interest in that pile driver I don't know and it has no bearing on the matter whatever.
Kountze—Is Mr. Green in any way connected or employed by the association in any other capacity than that of driving piles?
Geraldine—No, sir. He was employed a few days before that time. He was employed on the former pile driving when we drove the piles around the colonnade. I again employed to take charge of the pile driving around the lagoon. When he finished that work he left our employ. I offered him $3 a day to come back to our employ, which he declined, and he drove, as a contractor, the piling on the Mines and Mining building.
Kountze—As a competitive contractor?
Geraldine—I suppose so. I do not know.
Kountze—You have nothing to do with that?
Geraldine—No, sir, notwithstanding the fact that it has been stated in the newspapers that we did the work. As to the truthfulness of Mr. Connolly's statements, I understand Mr. Rosewater includes it in his charge; he stated that he made these proposals. The answer I have as to whether or not he is a truthful man in his written proposal there, which I ask you to examine and compare with the statement in the charges.
REGARDING THE LUMBER.
Now as to the quantities of lumber used. The order that I made for piling for this lumber is somewhat different in some dimensions from this drawing. This drawing shows a 3x10 for coping. I ordered a 4x8. If you refer to the specifications which I have been looking over, I see that it is specified in the original specifications as a 4x10. Now if we go by the drawings, which are 3x10 and which I distinctly remember is what we agreed upon, it would be different from what is stated in the specifications. In looking over the work I decided that 4x8 was ample, and ordered that from the Cady Lumber company. Now, as to there being a difference of 60,000 feet of lumber, that statement is grossly erroneous and untrue. You will observe that in the original drawings the connection; this shows the front side of the piling, where the water would be; that shows the sheet piling, there is the ditch and there is the six inches driven in. There is the pile driven to give strength to it; here is the anchor pile driven back a certain distance and fastened to this as an anchor; there is the excavation behind to be filled and tamped. In the revised specification, and you will notice I read to you in the contract, that we might at our option use wire cables instead of stringers, you will see that it is shown here that these piles are fastened together by a 2x8, the front pile fastened to the back pile by a 2x8. The change from 2x8 was made in the contract to galvanized wire cable. The amount of 2x8, as I roughly estimated it, which will be found nearly correct, necessary to make these connections as shown on the original drawings, would be about 16,000 feet. These were eliminated and a wire cable substituted. At the same time the distance between these was doubled. You will see here the distance is shown as fifteen feet here and twenty-four feet here, but the distance for which twenty-four-foot piling was to be used is shown here. There is the proportion that it bore to the whole job. This is the profile drawing, showing the various distances, heights and depths. A very small portion was made twenty-four feet. Now I changed the specifications to put these anchors back, none of them less than twenty feet, most of them twenty-six feet and some of them thirty feet.
Kountze—That was done before the contract was let on the revised plan and upon which both Creedon and Connolly bid, upon the same specifications?
Geraldine—Yes. Mr. Connolly both had that plan and both bid upon it.
Kountze—This change was not made, then, after the contract had been let to Creedon & Mahoney? And the cost of doing this kind of work instead of the other, was this way cheaper than it would have been?
COULD HAVE BEEN CHEAPER.
Geraldine—No, sir. It would have probably been cheaper had the same distance been maintained, but moving back double the distance doubled the labor of digging a ditch. The actual cost of doing the work, this was more than the other. This timber first contemplated was very cheap lumber; could be bought for $12 a thousand, so that, as you will find in my written reply, instead of being a donation to the contractor, it was an additional expense upon him. Now, it is further stated that the iron work was left out and the contractor was given a donation of $200 or thereabout in that manner. I will refer to the contract. The exposition reserves the right to change the manner of fastening the waling, to place the waling back of the sheet piling instead of in front and fastening to the piles by notching and mortising and toenailing, and the contractor agrees to make no additional charge should such a change be made. In ordering this lumber I had looked over the matter sufficiently and made this change in Mr. Shaw's plan, and instead of putting that waling on the front side, next to the water, I put it back of the sheet piling and turned it edgeways, getting the additional strength of turning the plank edgeways and mortising it in. Looking down from the top of the piling there is the sheet piling, there is the round pile and there is the waling, a diagonal mortise being put in from the back so that this waling was wedged in between every pile and would not come forward on account of the diagonal mortise and was toenailed in besides. Now, if you will look at this cavity behind the sheet piling for a moment you will see there it shows this waling edgeways and in some cases it went back much further, projecting back close to the bank. Now you will readily see that if this plank came back against the wall so much as it did in most cases that the earth behind there could not be tamped from above. Therefore it would be necessary for the contractor to do that tamping to excavate behind here so as to get down. That was something the contractor did not figure on. That is why I put in this specification in the contract about placing the waling timbers back of the sheet piling instead of in front and fastening to the piles by notching and toe-nailing if found advisable and the contractor agrees to make no additional charge should such a change be made. Now the fact is that the actual cost of putting in the waling in this manner as near as I can, estimate it was $200 greater than the original plan, including the iron work which is spoken of, and instead of being a donation to the contratcor was an expense of $200 or thereabout additional to him, for which he received nothing.
Kountze—There is another matter I did not quite understand. The coping, as I understand it in the specification, was 4x10, in the drawing 3x10, and subsequently there was substituted for the coping a 4x8. Now, [?]
ONE MORE OVERSIGHT.
Geraldine—Those changes were made before the contract was let. That change was made when I ordered the lumber, as I ordered it 4x8.
Kountze—That change was made, then, before the contract was let to Creedon & Mahoney?
Geraldine—Yes, sir; it was fully explained to both bidders.
Kountze—And both contractors bid on the same proposition?
Geraldine—Yes, sir.
Kountze—And the difference between the drawing and the specifications was fully understood by both of them?
Geraldine—Yes, sir.
Bidwell—As I understand it the specifications were originally drawn 4x10?
Geraldine—The specifications I find are written 4x10. I presume it is a mistake.
Bidwell—You claim that was an oversight?
Geraldine—Yes, that was an oversight. In making this contract instead of revising the entire specifications and noted here the changes we proposed to make and did not notice that the specifications read 4x10. I presume that is an error and the lumber actually furnished was 4x8. But that change was made before the contract was let and explained to both.
Bidwell—Is it customary where a contract is let that the drawings govern or the specifications?
Geraldine—They both govern, and if there is a discrepancy it is settled between the engineer and contractor. Now, I have a word to say in regard to Mr. Shaw, whose letter was read here. When I took up this work at the point of making drawings I made inquiry for a suitable man to help me with this work who might superintend it afterward. I inquired of Mr. Andrew Rosewater, who recommended Mr. Shaw. Mr. Shaw assisted me in this work and made these drawings. He wrote a portion of the specifications, which I afterward revised, and I discussed with him the propositions of taking charge of this work when it was let and intended to put it in his charge if he was an applicant for the work. On the day on which bids were received, or about that time. I was told that Mr. Connolly was bidding in connection with Mr. Shaw and was in partnership with him. This was later corroborated by a bid on the putting in of water pipe put in by Connolly & Shaw. I decided if that was the case and from my acquaintance with Mr. Shaw that I did not want him for superintendent on that work, and I did not employ him. I will, if you wish, take his letter and answer it in detail now or hereafter, just as you like. I simply wish to say that his statements as read by Mr. Rosewater are falsehoods.
Kountze—Should the committee decide later that they wanted a definite answer to Mr. Shaw's letter which is submitted here they will probably call for such further information.
Bidwell—Was there a distinct bid made by any of the contractors for this particular work?
Geraldine—All the bids I received are there.
Bidwell—What I am getting at is the cost of this work. Is there a bid on that?
Geraldine—No, I did not ask for a bid on that. I simply asked Raymond what he would do the work for. He said he would make me a bid on driving the piles and let me furnish them. His bid was too high. He asked five cents a foot and we drove them for less than 4 cents. He also made a proposition on driving the sheet piling, 30 cents apiece for two and one-half feet, or 20 cents apiece on the modified proposition. There are nearly 5,000 piles to be driven and you see what that would amount to.
Bidwell—There are none of these bids here that contain any figures by which you could compare the actual cost with what was paid.
Geraldine—Yes, sir; you will find it in my letter. I will read it to you, if you please. (Reads.)
Rosewater—You say that Mr. Connolley's bid was only $100 less than the original bid be made? The original bid was $7,900 and you say that after you made these changes on these specifications he was only willing to deduct $100, and you mean to state that when you changed from white pine to yellow pine and gave him the advantage of $3 per thousand he still would not deduct more than $100?
Geraldine—I mean to state the fact just as I have stated it. Mr. Connolley was not bidding on white pine. Mr. Connolley understood that yellow pine alone would be considered, Mr. Connolley's original bid shows prices on yellow pine.
Rosewater—I am saying that when he made his original bid he was bidding on white pine and that proposition was to make a first-class lumber enclosure. Now, then, you say he would not deduct but $100 in spite of the changing involving a difference of $3 a thousand on 170,000 feet of lumber. Isn't it a fact that you did not show him any of these specifications; that you told him verbally only of a few changes?
Geraldine—It is a fact that I had no specifications made at that time beyond what is shown here, and I showed him everything I had just the same as I showed it to Mr. Creedon.
Rosewater—I hope you will permit me to bring in the partner of Mr. Connolley and let him tell the story of what they were bidding on. He is right here, and it seems to me that before we close this question we might as well get right to the bottom of it. Of course his letter may be contradicted by statements.
(Mr. Shaw is introduced.)
Rosewater—Mr. Shaw, in your revised bid, what was your bid on the revised plan for this work?
PLANS ARE CHANGED.
Shaw—I will explain to you that at that time I was not a partner of Mr. Connolley, but I figured up his bids for him and understood all about them. It was just after the bids were put into the department here that he made a proposition to me to go into partnership with him, which I accepted, when we were trying to get this job. Now, to begin with, I made out the bid there, which amounted to $7,900. A day or two after the bids went in Mr. Connolley came up to my office and I suggested that he should go up and see Mr. Geraldine and see how we stood. Mr. Geraldine would not give him any satisfaction. That is the report he brought back to me. He was a little bit hot at Mr. Geraldine anyway; said he had up a $500 check there and thought he ought to be treated right and that Geraldine had about told him he couldn't get the contract anyway. That is the statement he came down to me with. I said: "You had better go and see some of the directors and we will try to get at this thing and see how we stand." He went to Mr. Hussie and Mr. Hussie went to Mr. Kirkendall. Mr. Kirkendall said he would see Mr. Geraldine, and I suppose he did. At least, when Hussie had seen Mr. Kirkendall he said: "You go and see Geraldine and he will treat you right." And Mr. Geraldine treated him first rate and used him as he ought to be used. I think it was the very same day, I am not very sure, but at any rate Mr. Geraldine told him to make over another proposition; to look it over and see if he could not cut down his original estimate. And the second proposition was, instead of driving the sheet piling, they would dig two feet and drive the six-inch point into the ground, and to give him a bid on that footing. And the third was to give him a bid for the labor only, the exposition company supplying all the material. Well, I went over everything with him again and we looked it up and I found that we could cut down probably $100 off our original bid, and I think we took off for the excavations and the driving six inches, so the bid stood $7,100. I forget just exactly what it was for labor. Now, that was all the information that I got from Mr. Connolley. There was nothing about the alteration of the plans; in fact we did not know that the plans were altered until we happened to go up to the office one day, I think it was when the sewer contract was to be let, and we walked into the draughtsman's room and there we saw the altered plan. We were thunderstruck with it and that was the first thing that we began to see that we had not been used right.
Rosewater—That was after the second bid was put in?
Shaw—After Creedon & Mahoney had got the contract.
Kountze—The time you speak of here as visiting Mr. Geraldine was at the time that your first bid had been under consideration, $7,900, was it not?
Shaw—I don't understand.
Kountze—You had a bid in, or rather Mr. Connolley had a bid in, for $7,900?
Shaw—Yes, sir.
Kountze—And it was the time the first set of bids were under consideration that Mr. Connolley visited Mr. Geraldine to get information in regard to his first bid?
Shaw—Yes, sir.
Kountze—When Mr. Geraldine told him that he wouldn't get the contract?
Shaw—Yes, sir.
Kountze—Subsequent to that new bids were taken from Mr. Connolley and from Creedon & Mahoney, and didn't I understand from you that when you put this second bid in for this work, or rather Mr. Connolley, that he did not know what he was bidding on?
BID WITHOUT SPECIFICATIONS.
Shaw—He was told verbally by Mr. Geraldine what to bid on. I said this, that he was told to look over his original bid and see if he could cut his estimate down somewhere. That we did by lowering that $100. He was told also to see what difference it would make instead of driving the sheet piling two feet six, as called for in the original specifications, to cut a trench two feet deep and drive the point six inches. Well, there was enough to cut off by doing that to bring the estimate down to $7,100.
Kountze—Are you quite sure?
Shaw—Positive.
Kountze—I understand you did not have any specifications when you put in this second bid?
Shaw—Nothing except the verbal explanation from Mr. Geraldine to Mr. Connolley, which Mr. Connolley brought to me.
Kountze—I understand, Mr. Geraldine, that the specifications had been modified when this gentleman bid on them?
Geraldine—Yes, sir, the modifications were fully explained.
Kountze—And did they have a copy of it, or was it simply verbal?
Geraldine—It was verbal. I simply explained to these bidders the changes that are embodied in this contract.
Kountze—Mr. Shaw, doesn't this appear in your bid? You say that in making your bid for $7,800 you bid to drive your piles six inches and to dig a trench and set them in?
Shaw—No, sir.
Kountze—What did you say?
Shaw—On the bid of $7,800 we were going to drive the sheet piling two feet and six inches.
Kountze—Well, but when you made the deduction of $700?
Shaw—When we made that deduction we were going to dig a trench two feet and drive the piling six inches, which made two feet six.
Kountze—Isn't this the condition of your bid? If sheet piling is allowed to be set in trench instead of being driven, deduct $700?
Shaw—That may be the language of it, but the intention was to drive them in the six inches.
Kountze—Wouldn't we have to assume that the bid was made and as written would be what you intended to do? We could not assume that you should do something different from what you bid for?
Shaw—Well, you can take it in that form. But the language there does not convey just exactly what was told us to be done.
Kountze—This fact is very explicit and certainly Mr. Geraldine or the association could not have required you to have driven those piles one inch under this proposition.
COULD HAVE BEEN BY CONTRACT.
Shaw—It could have been arranged in the contract easy enough, because it was a verbal understanding.
Kountze—Well, but you must hold to your proposition, not what you might have done under other circumstances, but what you actually bid for.
Shaw—There is no doubt that what I have given in black and white there is not just exactly what is wanted.
Kountze—It is exactly as you bid.
Shaw—I understand that, sir.
Kountze—And exactly as the association would have to consider it in drawing a contract for you to do the work, and, drawing it differently, I should judge that you would have been entitled to additional pay if they gave you additional work.
Shaw—Well, I don't think there would have been any dispute about that at all.
Kountze—Well, we will pass that. What were the other questions here?
Bidwell—Were your present with Mr. Connolley when he made this arrangement with Mr. Geraldine?
Shaw—No, sir; I was in my office. Mr. Connolley came down and reported to me.
Bidwell—You are simply stating what Mr. Connolley told you?
Shaw—Yes, sir; that is right.
Rosewater—Do you know in this $7,800 bid whether you counted to furnish white pine or yellow pine?
Shaw—White pine, and I will tell you why. We consulted with the lumber dealers here and we found that it was impossible for us to get yellow pine shipped in here in time to complete the contract at the date specified.
Rosewater—How much higher was white pine than yellow pine at that date?
Shaw—I won't say, because that is just the answer we got and we wouldn't go any higher for it. But yellow pine is cheaper than good white pine.
Rosewater—Have you any idea what the difference in price was or would have been?
Shaw—Well, I would say from $1 to $2 a thousand; that the yellow pine would be cheaper than the white pine, but I would not say exactly. But I will tell you that our bid from our lumber dealer was $18 a thousand for white pine.
Rosewater—The lumber dealers asked you $18 a thousand.
Shaw—That was the price made by them.
Rosewater—You figured on furnishing lumber that cost you $18 when you put in your bid for $7,800.
Shaw—Yes, sir.
Rosewater—Had you supposed you could get yellow pine, what would you have bid?
Shaw—We could not bid at all on yellow pine because they would not agree to deliver it to us at all in time to complete the contract.
Rosewater—Were you offered any lumber by the exposition association or by Mr. Geraldine?
Shaw—No, sir; neither Mr. Connolley nor myself.
Rosewater—What quality of white pine was this that you were bidding on?
Shaw—It was to comply with the specifications. The specifications did not call for any quality.
Rosewater—Will you explain the difference between the specifications as they are now, as you found them on the present work as done and what there was in the original as you drew it first and as you bid on it?
BAD WORK ON LAGOON.
Shaw—I don't know what the present specifications are, but I had occasion to go out on the works a couple of weeks ago to see this new patent pile driver, and while there I just made an examination of the works to see how things were going. And I found considerable alteration from what I intended. The sheet piling itself, instead of being down two feet six, ranged anywhere from one to two feet below the surface of the ground; none of it exceeding two feet. The coping should have been 4x12 and it is 4x8. The circular ends of that coping were specified to be broad enough so as to dress twelve inches wide all around, but even in the eight-inch stuff it has not been made wide enough to dress eight inches, all around, and you will find in the center of the sticks it is only six inches. There is no walling put on, the piling is being irregularly driven, so that they could not construct the work according to the plans I made. The piles are all zigzag, some out and some in. I saw several while there that were cut more than three-quarters through in order to line up the face of the piling and they are no good that way for if any pressure comes against those piles away goes the [?]
the irregular manner in [?]es had been driven and they [?]waling piece at the back of the [?]ng and made a kind of attempt [?]ve it into the piles, but it was the [?]test looking thing you ever saw. The rest of it was tacked in by a couple of nails, just nailed up. Now the piles were specified to be not less than twelve inches on the head and eight inches at the bottom. Seventy per cent of those piles don't run over nine inches on the head.
GERALDINE TALKS OF PILING.
Kountze—You made a remark, Mr. Shaw, a minute ago that the work is not done as you intended to do it.
Shaw—That is right, sir.
Kountze—Did you intend to do the work otherwise than called for by the specifications?
Shaw—As called for in the plans and specifications.
Kountze—Then you state that the work as done now by Creedon & Mahoney is not done according to the specifications.
Shaw—It may be according to the new specifications, but not according to the ones we bid on.
Kountze—How is that, Mr. Geraldine?
Geraldine—The only difference in the work as done now and as originally intended is what has been shown in the explanation I have given, with the exception that the piling is set uniformly ten feet apart. In the original design it was intended to be various distances apart, 9 feet 8 inches, 7 feet 8 inches, and in the very high portions 6 feet 8 inches. In going over the work I found that to be unnecessary; that there was sufficient strength without putting the piling in so numerously, and put it in uniformly ten feet apart. Don't know just what the difference would be, but probably would be twenty or thirty piles in all.
Kountze—What is there in this matter that Mr. Shaw claims, that the piles were so indifferently driven that in order to straighten up that work it was necessary to cut the piles down to such a condition that they lost their usefulness?
Geraldine—That statement is untrue. It is either the result of ignorance or willful falsehood.
Shaw—I would be glad to take you and show you Thursday, or your representative, where I saw the piles. I know where to go for them and Mr. Connolley was with me.
Geraldine—In driving this piling, you understand it is necessary to get it back to the proper facing and up from the wall somewhat, and in driving the piling at the bottom of the wall, as in this case, the displacement was greater at the front side on the level bottom of the ditch than against the high wall, and of course the inclination of the pile would be to go that way. Now, it is difficult to get the piling exactly lined in driving, so that sometimes to put a pile in the proper place it was necessary to incline it somewhat. Then when we come to put on the anchors the pile was drawn into line by being drawn into place. If it was too far this way it was turned with a jack and if it was too far at the bottom it was cut off.
Kountze—How many were too far at the bottom?
Geraldine—Very few. There was one pile set so far out that the box above it would nearly cut the pile off to bring it to line. After they had done this work I ordered them to remove the box because from its location the remaining part was sufficiently strong, and it was totally unnecessary to have anything more and it left a better finished job, by far, to cut it off. But the factor of safety provided in this anchorage is very high. It is probable, if it was not for the great length of waling, one pile every eighteen or twenty feet would be sufficient, but in order to get it absolutely safe and sufficiently strong I put the piling every ten feet.
Kountze—Have you anything further to state as to this?
MUCH MORE BAD WORK.
Shaw—I was just going to say this, that a lot of those piles were driven down below the level of the coping. I don't know how many, but a lot of them. And there were little pieces, maybe two inches thick, put on the top to bring it up to the level of the coping. In one case I saw two or three pieces put on the under side of the coping. The whole strain, if any of that clay should move at all, the whole strain comes on the coping and it is held ther by a little two-inch nail going into the pile. Those were specified to be wood lag screws and there was to have been none of those packing pieces at all. I will say this, that it is a very dangerous thing to have.
Geraldine—At one point on the lagoon there were several piles driven below the required level, but they were not driven below the point of anchorage.
Kountze—Not below the point that the pile is anchored back?
Geraldine—No; in these cases I authorized the spiking of pieces on the top and pieces of planking were put on the top and spiked on and the coping was spiked to that. Now, the coping goes in this manner. (Describes coping from drawing.)
Kountze—What is the fact, Mr. Geraldine, about using the spikes instead of lag screws, as Mr. Shaw says the specifications called for?
Geraldine—The specifications called for lag screws when we designed to put the waling on in this manner, on the front. There is the end of the waling, and there is the lag screw holding it to the pile. In this case all the protection the sheet piling would have would be the hold of those lag screws in the soft pile. In the other case the waling is put in in this manner, mortised from the back side, so that it cannot move forward without bringing the piling with it. In the other case it would only be necessary for it to pull the lag screws. This is the more expensive method.
Kountze—What is the fact in regard to fastening the piling to the coping. Would it be possible to drive that piling in in the manner which Mr. Shaw spoke of?
Geraldine—No, sir?
Kountze—The manner of your construction would not allow the catastrophe that Mr. Shaw indicated here?
Geraldine—No, sir. Let me state that is this was loose earth with its natural slope, instead of the solid bank that it is, the pile is strong enough to hold it. I was obliged to figure against the thrust of a loose bank of earth for this reason, that in the freezing and thawing this winter a portion of the bank might be sluffed off in that manner and the piling forced to receive the entire thrust of that loose earth. Therefore, I provided for that. I found in looking over Mr. Shaw's drawings that he had designated only ten feet to put these anchors back. Now, the natural incline of a sluffed bank of loose earth would come in this manner to the bottom of the lagoon and would go beyond where he proposed to place the anchors. For that reason I changed his plans, putting the anchor piles further back.
Shaw—You will find it further in the longer piles.
Geraldine—That is correct, but it is not sufficient in the short piles. The anchor, to be safe, should go beyond the point at which the earth would crumble if it was loose; otherwise it would be no protection.
SHAW PRESENTS FIGURES.
Shaw—I figured, gentlemen, that the lumber which was being saved from the method in which the work has been constructed and the plans we bid on are as follows: On the backstays there is 21,333 feet. On the short sheeting—that is to say, they did not put it down two feet and six inches—that it amounts to 15,000 feet, and if it had been two feet it would have been more. For the coping, it was originally 4x12 and it is now 4x8.
Kountze—I understood you, Mr. Geraldine, to say that it was 4x10 reduced to 4x8.
Geraldine—The specifications show it.
Kountze—It would have taken twelve-inch lumber, then, would it, to give you the curve and finish ten?
Geraldine—Yes, on the curve. On the straight there would be nothing cut away.
Shaw—The saving on the coping is 6,664 feet. The waling, instead of being 3x8, is 3x6 and that saves 1,666 feet. The mortise and tenon are only three-eighths of an inch and I don't think they are much good. You might just as well have straight joints. The plan shows them an inch and the saving on that alone is 5,1016 feet, making a total, with the cutting of a foot off the sheet piling, of 49,679 feet, and if you cut another foot off, which I believe it will stand, it is close to 60,000 feet.
Kountze—Mr. Shaw, in your bid of $7,800 did you bid on a different specification from that on which Creedon & Mahoney bid?
Shaw—I don't know. We bid on the specifications that were there for the bidders.
Kountze—Was there more than one specification?
Shaw—I don't know. I prepared the specifications myself and Mr. Geraldine looked them over and altered some things in them.
Kountze—Mr. Geraldine, was this piling which Mr. Shaw claims he figured on a foot longer than that which Mr. Creedon furnished?
Geraldine—The sheet piling?
Kountze—Yes, sir.
Geraldine—No, sir; Mr. Creedon furnished the same length of piling that the original plan called for. This is the sheet piling, you understand, that I ordered from the Cady Lumber company, and was the piling actually used. That was ordered and the estimate made on the first plans.
Kountze—And was of the same length that Mr. Shaw bid on?
Geraldine—Yes, sir; that is, you understand that there is very little of this that was put in full length. It was ordered in long lengths and short. A great deal of the piling was cut at ten feet, eleven feet, twelve feet, and thirteen feet, according to the depth of the lagoon, or rather according to the depth of the bank.
Kountze—Was there a different class of lengths furnished by Creedon & Mahoney than was contemplated in the original plan upon which Mr. Shaw claims that the original bid of $7,900 and subsequently $7,800 was made?
Geraldine—No; that was ordered before the distance of eighteen inches was decided upon for sinking the piling. The greater portion of it was driven to the full depth and some lower, so that this piling is driven on an average more than two feet.
Kountze—The piling that is now in?
Geraldine—In some places, there is a curtain location where it is short, where in cutting the lengths of piling to get the required slant that it was short and only went in the ground sixteen inches. I found some that only went in sixteen inches, but there were very few pieces and in that case we required very careful work in the puddling and tamping to avoid leaking rather than incur the delay of waiting for more lumber.
THOUGHT SOMETHING WAS WRONG.
Kountze—Creedon & Mahoney were offered that lumber? Shaw was not offered the lumber, or Shaw & Connolley? Now what was the advantage to Mr. Creedon in getting the benefit of your contract over what Mr. Connolley could have bought the lumber for?
Geraldine—None, whatever. What Mr. Connolley could have bought the lumber for I don't know. As to what the lumber would have been furnished in the market for, giving Mr. Creedon an advantage, when I asked Mr. Creedon what price he had figured on for lumber, he quoted a price lower than he actually paid for what he used.
Kountze—Mr. Shaw, you say the price quoted to you for white pine for this work, tongued and grooved, was $18?
Shaw—Yes, sir.
Kountze—Who was your man who was offering the lumber?
Shaw—The Wyatt-Bullard company.
Kountze—Did you try any of the other lumbermen?
Shaw—I don't know whether Connolley did or not, I did not. I was going to say, gentlemen, that in addition to the lumber bill I have given you, there will be fully forty-five piles saved in that job.
Kountze—What was the value of each pile driven?
Shaw—Oh, it was worth a dollar, anyway; at least that. And the bolts were done away with, and I figured up that the price of that wire and putting it on would not cost as much as the bolts and boring of the holes for putting the bolts in.
Kountze—Mr. Shaw, wasn't Mr. Connolley informed that the change had been made substituting wire instead of wood, and that he bid with that in view?
Shaw—I will tell you honestly, I don't believe it, because Mr. Connolley and I, the first information we knew of it, was when we went up into Mr. Geraldine's room there to look up the sewer contract. We walked in to the draughtsman's table and there was the plan with this new section on it, showing this wire and everything else that we had never seen before; never knew a thing about it before. That is what made us begin to think there was something wrong.
Kountze—That is, you did not know when you put in your revised bid that this wire binding to the stay-tie was to be used instead of wood?
Shaw—We did not. Did not know it. Was never thought of at the time. All the alteration that we bid on was to cut that trench two feet and drive six inches, instead of driving two feet six inches. That was the only thing we ever knew about the alteration of the plan.
Geraldine—The statement is untrue; absolutely false.
Bidwell—Your dealer bid on white pine lumber at $18 a thousand, and that was the basis of your bid of $7,800? If you had known that you could have bought lumber, white pine lumber, tongued and grooved, for $14.50, would that have made a difference of $3.50 per thousand on your bid?
Shaw—Yes, sir. We bid on the basis of $800 profit on that bid of $7,900.
Bidwell—If, as a matter of fact, you had called for a bid from Mr. Hoagland and had received an offer to furnish this lumber, white pine lumber tongued and grooved, at $14.50 instead of $18, you would have reduced your bid that much?
Shaw—Yes, sir. We were content with that margin of profit and we could have reduced our bid.
Bidwell—As a matter of fact Hoagland did offer to furnish the offer for that money?
Shaw—He did, but we did not know it.
Rosewater—Were you aware that this work was to be done in yellow pine, could you have taken that contract at that time and filled it by September 10, as proposed, in yellow pine if that had been accepted?
Shaw—We could not get the Wyatt-Bullard company to say that they could get us the stuff in time to finish the job. We had an option to bid on yellow pine, but we did not do it.
Rosewater—And you did not know anything about the purchase the exposition made from the other lumber company and that was turned over to Mahoney & Creedon?
Shaw—Did not know a thing about it, neither Mr. Connolley nor myself.
PURCHASE, BUT NO CONTRACT.
Rosewater—I want Mr. Geraldine to state as far as he knows, expressed in quantity by feet, of lumber purchased by the exposition and turned over to Creedon & Mahoney.
Geraldine—I don't recollect. I judge it was about 170,000 feet.
Kountze—Mr. Geraldine, in order to make that point clear, did the association buy any lumber and pay for it, or did they simply make a contract for lumber and transfer the contract to Creedon & Mahoney?
Geraldine—They made a contract for lumber and transferred the contract.
Kountze—They never made the purchase? They never received the lumber themselves?
Geraldine—No, sir.
Kountze—But they did make a contract by which they were to take a certain quantity of lumber, and that contract was referred to Creedon & Mahoney, and that was probably 175,000 feet?
Geraldine—Yes, sir; in that vicinity.
Rosewater—Now, you have that contract?
Geraldine—There was no contract. It was a verbal order, and a pencil memorandum of the amount of lumber required.
Rosewater—Have you no agreement in writing by which the lumber company fixed the price in writing at which that lumber was to be delivered for the exposition?
Geraldine—No, sir.
Rosewater—You stated that the lumber was bought at $14.50 per thousand?
Geraldine—Yes.
Rosewater—Was that all the lumber used in that lagoon?
Geraldine—No, sir.
Rosewater—How much other lumber was there used?
Geraldine—I should judge that—I don't know how much. The contractor had to get more—probably 20,000 feet. I don't know.
Rosewater—Is that also yellow pine from the same yard?
Geraldine—Furnished by the same people.
Rosewater—So that, all in all, there would have been 195,000 feet used in the lagoon in its construction?
Geraldine—Somewhere in the vicinity of 200,000 feet.
Rosewater—Now you stated that the piles and the driving of the piling was $779?
Geraldine—Yes.
Rosewater—That, with the lumber got, was all the material used in the lagoon, was it not, and included the labor of driving the piles?
Geraldine—I do not know as I understand your question.
Rosewater—The piles driven by our own people and bought by the exposition, together with 195,000 feet of lumber which Creedon & Mahoney purchased and supplied, was all the material used in that lagoon, was it not?
Geraldine—No, I think not.
Rosewater—What was there besides? I am talking of material now.
Geraldine—There were cables for anchoring the posts, the nails and the white lead or paint that was used.
Rosewater—How much white lead was used?
Geraldine—I do not know. It was put on the west end of the lagoon for about half or two-thirds the distance around.
Rosewater—I notice that in this bill (I presume it is receipted) the amount charged as the cost of piles is $345.89 and the labor is $419.40. In round figures, then, the labor which the exposition has bought is equal to $400. Now, Mr. Geraldine, you stated yesterday that Connolley offered to do the labor for $2,800. Is that correct?
Geraldine—I think his bid shows that.
Rosewater—Did that include the work of pile driving and completing all that work?
Geraldine—His bid will explain.
Rosewater—I have not examined the bid, and I want to know that because I want a clear idea of it.
ADDITIONS AND DEDUCTIONS.
Geraldine—Yes, I think his bid included all the labor.
Rosewater—So that, deducting what you have paid already, say $400, there would have been only $2,300 to add for Mr. Connolley if he had done that work under his bid?
Geraldine—I think there is about $80 of that that was paid for the use of the pile driver or for repairing.
Rosewater—Is that charged to the labor?
Geraldine—I think so. It is included in the complete work.
Rosewater—The reduction was about $80? That would make the computation of labor equal to $2,380, the whole labor. I am talking about separating the materials from the labor. The 135,000 feet at $14.50 per 1,000 would be equal to $2,827.50. To that should be added for piles and pile driving together $779.93, and the estimated labor for which it could be done or bought of Connolley we would put at being equal to $2,380. I want to ask now how much, in round figures, the value of the white lead, the nails and the anchoring yould be in round figures?
Geraldine—About $400.
Rosewater—We will place that at $400. But you are aware, I suppose, that only a very small part of the work was leaded?
Geraldine—No, I didn't say so.
Rosewater—That is the way it is represented to me.
Geraldine—I did not represent it so.
Rosewater—Very well; we have then a general computation as regards what the cost of this work would have been had the exposition bought the material as it had originally done so, paid for all the labor and completed the work on its own account. Did this bid of Connolley's of $2,800 include the original specifications or was it on the modified specifications?
Geraldine—Will you repeat the question?
Rosewater—Was the bid of $2,800, for labor, made by Connolley on the original specifications or on the revised specifications?
Geraldine—On the modified and revised specifications.
Rosewater—Now the contract that was made by this exposition right here does not show anything as to the depth of the sheet piling to be driven or the changes that were made, does it?
Geraldine—All that is shown on the plans. In lieu of driving the sheet piling as shown in specifications, the contractor is allowed the option of sinking a trench one foot in depth and not more than five inches wide on the line of said piling, the piling to be driven six inches below the bottom of this trench.
Rosewater—Now, was there any change made in this contract at all? I mean, this is the contract exactly as it was made, is it not? No change made after that?
Geraldine—No, sir.
Rosewater—In here it says the material to be used was to be white pine; was no change made?
Geraldine—That was explained last night. If the committee wishes me to go over the ground again, I will do it.
Rosewater—I have examined this today and the specifications call for white pine clearly.
Kountze—I believe the reasons were given last evening why yellow pine was substituted for white pine. If it is material Mr. Geraldine can state it again.
Rosewater—It will probably appear, then, because you will have a copy of all that was said.
CONCERNING PINE LUMBER.
Geraldine—Perhaps a little more enlightenment on that might be well. Mr. Rosewater stated that the specifications called for white pine, clear. Sheet piling to be of white pine, sound, free from sap, loose knots, shakes or cracks. That is not clear. Clear white pine would be worth from $18 per 1,000 feet upward, as near as I can recollect. In order to get clear white pine it would have to be made a special order, which would take considerable time to fill. It could not be dried by steam, as the southern pine is dried, because they do not use that process in the north, and to air dry it properly would take a month. Besides it would be too expensive and the only advantage gained in using this clear white pine would be its durability. Now, No. 1 yellow pine, which is under the same classifications here, the restrictions as to quality are more severe and it is a better class of material as far as defects are concerned. And after specifying white pine and looking up the matter very thoroughly I found, as before stated, that it was undesirable to use it at all and at the time I settled the question it was out of consideration altogether. We considered it at all times, as appears in the form of bid as given to contractors to bid on, in which they were requested to bid on yellow pine. Now, there may be some misunderstanding as to the prices quoted here last night.
Wells—If it was understood that they were bidding on yellow pine, why was the contract filled in calling for white pine?
Geraldine—The specifications as first prepared called for white pine.
Wells—I understand this is the contract made subsequently.
Geraldine—In the contract it does appear, but in correcting the old specifications first made that was overlooked and was not taken out. But it was not considered at any time and these bids will show you that we took the figures on yellow pine as the basis of the bid. Now, for instance, here is Creedon & Mahoney's bid. Notice in the tabulation of the bids we give their figures as $8,161. That is the figure on yellow pine, as you will notice by the tabulation, and in the other tabulations we took the figures on yellow pine only; did not consider the figures on white pine quoted; no intention of using it, and there was not a contractor who figured on this work or talked about it afterward but what thoroughly understood that yellow pine was what we intended to use.
Wells—May I ask you whether it was understood by Connolley that he was to use yellow pine?
Geraldine—Yes, sir, and he bid on yellow pine. His last proposition was on yellow pine.
Wells—That was the proposition under which the contract was let?
Geraldine—Yes, sir.
Rosewater—Are you not mistaken about that? I asked you whether you were not mistaken about that statement that Connolley's bid was on yellow pine.
Geraldine—I have made that statement distinctly here several times, and I am not apt to be mistaken in a positive statement of that kind.
Rosewater—You made the statement here also that this purchase was made of the Cady Lumber company with the idea that we were saving $1.50, or about that, per thousand?
Geraldine—I made what statement?
Rosewater—Was it not stated to the board at your instance that we were saving at least $1.50 per thousand in purchasing that lumber?
Geraldine—It was stated by you that I had said so, but it was not true. I did not make that statement.
Rosewater—You did not make that statement to Mr. Kirkendall? Mr. Kirkendall invented that story?
EVADES THE QUESTION.
Geraldine—Now there seems to be a misunderstanding in regard to that matter as far as Mr. Kirkendall is concerned in it which I wish to make clear to the committee. In my written statement here, if you have read it over, you will recollect I stated that the bids were opened and rejected. I explained to Mr. Kirkendall that it would be wise to order this lumber in order to get it under way, as I wished to get a perfectly clear quality of lumber, the best we could get of yellow pine. I wished to have it specially prepared, on a tongue and groove design I would furnish. I wished to have it thoroughly dried by steam, wished to get a perfect quality, and I wished to have it sawed one-quarter of an inch thicker than the regular stock, in order to get the fullest strength of the three-inch plank. I said that in order to get this special order through in time it would be necessary to order it now, at the time. I also stated that if I put that in the specifications or asked the contractor to furnish material of that particular kind it would probably add two or three—if I remembered correctly, add considerably to their figures in estimating, while I believed, and corroborated that belief by calling up the Cady Lumber company (he and the representative of the wholesalers at Kansas City came to the office and discussed the matter there) that they would furnish this lumber on that special order for $14.50 per thousand. To get that lumber ordinarily or get it through a contractor's bid would probably cost $2 or $3 more on a special order. But by ordering it now and getting what we wanted at that figure, which was the common price, it would be a considerable advantage to the exposition and would make a material difference in the cost of the work as compared with calling for new specifications. The saving to the exposition company was there. It is possible Mr. Kirkendall may not have gotten that idea clearly, or he may have expressed as a saving to the exposition of $1.50 per thousand, which would be correct, but not in the market price of lumber; but in the quality and dimension.
Rosewater—Was that lumber planed on both sides?
Geraldine—No, sir.
Rosewater—What was the dimension of that lumber when delivered here at the lagoon?
Geraldine—Scant three inches.
Rosewater—I will now bring in a gentleman and present you with a sample of the lumber to show the board just what we did get. I will introduce Mr. Mulhall, who was formerly employed for a great many years in Mr. Hoagland's lumber yard.
Mulhall—I was in the employ for the last seventeen years or more of Gray, and Mr. Hoagland part of the time.
Kountze—Was Mr. Mulhall brought here as an expert in the lumber business?
Rosewater—No, I told him to go out there and get a piece of that lumber, and I wanted to show him that he went out there and that he compared it with the other lumber in the lagoon as to its size.
Kountze—We will hear what Mr. Mulhall has to say.
Mulhall—All that I have to say is that I measured it and compared it, and that is what I would call one of the best pieces I saw. There were not many pieces around. I was requested to bring in a piece and I was also requested to measure it. I was told it would measure three and one-fourth inches and here it is only two and three-fourths. Another thing I wish to say about it, that for that purpose this lumber is too dry. We sold out of Mr. Hoagland's yard down there; we supplied the bridge company with this kind of lumber for their floor in the Council Bluffs bridge, but it was not tongued or grooved in any shape or form, and the life of it then, even with the sap in, is only from three to four years with the wooden block on top of it, even after being tarred and felt laid on it. And the life of this for the business this is used for out in the lagoon, it is not the kind of material that should be used at all in my estimation for the use against the water there. With the sap in it, it would be a great deal better. The tongue and groove of course is in addition to that, but it would be also better if it was undressed for that purpose, in place of being dressed. And then if it is like what I have seen there in the face of it, it is very knotty and it would not be taken, it would not be allowed, it could not be used for any other purpose except there. I would not call it No. 2 even. It wouldn't be accepted; it could not be sold in any market in the country only at a lower grade than what it is there. That is all I can say.
POOR QUALITY OF LUMBER.
Wells—That is an average piece in thickness?
Mulhall—It is just two and three-quarters as it is now. I took a square from one man and measured it.
Wells—Is that the average?
Mulhall—That is the same thickness of all the lagoon, I went along the edge and took a square and measured the tops of the planks and they all only measure two and three-quarters. I have no interest in the matter in any shape or form, but was simply asked to go out there and asked to bring in a piece for this inspection.
Wells—I understand you to say that that is better than the average?
Mulhall—No, I took a saw, sir, and cut that off a piece that was there.
Wells—Didn't you state that the average lumber there was not as good as this piece?
Mulhall—No, sir, that is, it is not free from knots. But you go along the face of the lagoon down and you will find that the lumber is very knotty and when it dries out a little those knots are apt to loosen and fall out. Then there is another thing in relation to putting it in there in water. These grooves here should have been all leaded. They should at least be painted inside, or white-leaded inside just as they were put in.
Wells—What would be the life of that in the water after being leaded?
Mulhall—I would not swear to it, but I would not put the life in water at over two years, or two and a half, for it is dry and as soon as it takes the water it will rot very quickly. There is no sap in it in any shape or form and when the sap is out of it, in the water it is of no use. It is never used in the market for cisterns or anything of that kind. It is all right for inside work, but where it is exposed to the sun or the weather outside, or water, it soon warps and gets all out of place. It is good enough for flooring inside when it is kiln dried, or anything like that. The majority of this stuff is used to cover areaways or the like of that brick, perhaps, is put on top of it or where there is stone. It is sometimes used to go over sidewalks in areaways.
Kountze—What has been your experience in that class of timber? Have you had any?
Mulhall—Sir?
Kountze—What has been your experience in using this lumber?
Mulhall—No experience, only what I have seen. I have seen it in the bridge, as I say, down here, fully three inches thick, undressed, and I have observed the life of it there, where it is covered with wooden blocks and tarred and tar felt put on it. The life is only from three to four years. None of these firms ever kept a large supply of this on hand, for there is no call for it. Mr. Hoagland supplies the bridge company with it, but he only keeps a small supply on hand.
Kountze—If placed in water would that cause it to decay quicker?
Mulhall—Yes, sir.
Kountze—Have you had any experience?
Mulhall—No experience.
Kountze—Then you do not know, except what you heard?
Mulhall—I never saw any of it used in water in that way.
Kountze—That is simply an impression without any knowledge? It is simply your belief?
Mulhall—It is only a very few years in the market here, inside of the last eight of ten years, that this yellow pine has come into the market at all. Very few of these western firms here carried it until the last eight or ten years and none of this grade
or thickness. It is used now for drop siding and for flooring and inside finishing, but none of it for outside work.
Kountze—Didn't you state that to place that material in the lagoon in the water, that it would last only two years, or three at most?
Mulhall—That would be my opinion, seeing the life of it here in the bridge.
Kountze—You have had no experience with this timber placed in such a position as this is placed, have you?
Mulhall—No, sir.
SAMPLE BETTER THAN AVERAGE.
Bidwell—How does it come that there is no corresponding tenon on this side of that stick?
Mulhall—No what?
Geraldine—It is only a portion of the plank. If it was a full sized sample it would be twelve inches wide.
Bidwell—Why didn't you cut off a piece of the full width?
Mulhall—There was none there. There was not a short piece at all that I could find to cut any off from. There is none around the lagoon that is anywhere near the width of that in the lagoon. This is the only piece I could find. I could have fished out a wet piece, but I had nothing to do it with. I went all around and then borrowed a saw from one of the carpenters to get this. It was the only stick I could find, and as I was asked to bring a piece, I brought it. I measured the others to compare with the thickness of this, and it compares in thickness; is the same thickness all along. It is all two and three-quarters.
Bidwell—That is a fair sample, then, as to the thickness, and you think it is a fair sample as to the quality of the plank?
Mulhall—It is an extra sample as to quality, I would call it. It is better. That is, it looks better than the most of it that is in the lagoon to see the face of it just as it is put up, for you to take this stick all through and it was free from knots, and there is a great deal of it that is knotty. And then it is cracked, just the same as this is.
Geraldine—Do you know whether this is a piece of lumber that was shipped here on the first order, or a piece of the portion that was supplied to fill up the deficiency afterward?
Mulhall—I don't know anything about that. All I know about that is that I went out there today at 2 o'clock and got this on the grounds there; cut it off of a stick that was there and fetched it in.
Wells—I would like to have you state whether the contractors, Creedon & Mahoney, knew at this time that three and one-quarter inch lumber was expected to be used.
Geraldine—They did not. It was not mentioned in the contract.
Wells—What was the date that you made this purchase of the Cady Lumber Company?
Geraldine—The 24th of July the verbal order was given subject to the approval of the committee.
Wells—What was the date of advertising for bids for this work?
Geraldine—I do not remember, but it must have been about ten days prior. I should judge that it was about the 14th that we advertised for bids. Then after advertising for the bids, receiving the bids, finding them too high and recommending their rejection, to prevent further delay, knowing that it would take considerable time to get the lumber, I then recommended the order to be given, with a view to using it if we put the lumber in ourselves or turning it over to a contractor if we contracted the job.
Wells—What was the date, do you remember, these bids were opened?
Geraldine—The 24th of July.
Wells—And five days later, I believe, the contract was let?
Geraldine—The 13th of August the contract was dated. It was some time before that it was let. Now, a word about this lumber. You will find in my written statement I say that this lumber is the best lot of lumber I have handled for years. If the committee wish to be satisfied on that I should suggest that they examine it or send some one on whose evidence or knowledge they can depend. As to the thickness of the lumber, it shows. Yellow pine lumber when it is cut green, prior to the process of drying by steam, will shrink under that process on a three-inch plank ordinarily a quarter of an inch. This lumber, I should judge from examining it when it came, at the time it was run into the steamer and kilned would have measured fully three inches. When it came here I measured numerous pieces of it. It measured scant three inches. Scant three inches in anything over two and seven-eighths inches. The ordinary lumber put through the same process, of the ordinary dimension, that this has gone through would measure a quarter of an inch less. That is the difference that was to be made in the sawing.
Kountze—Then would I infer from that, Mr. Geraldine, that this beam, two and three-quarter inches, is not a piece of the lumber that was taken under the first contract?
CANNOT ANSWER THIS.
Geraldine—I am not prepared to say whether it is or not.
Kountze—This measures only 2¾ inches?
Geraldine—That is all. I could not say whether that was the lumber that was used to fill out with or whether it was a piece of the original stock.
Kountze—Was there any difference in the thickness between the lumber that was given under the contract made by you and that which was furnished to supply the deficiency?
Geraldine—Unfortunately, there was about a quarter of an inch.
Kountze—Then the lumber in the lagoon is not all of a thickness? It is either heavier or lighter?
Geraldine—There are two classes in the lagoon, one thicker than the other. I an inclined to think that that is a piece of the original order. I do not know whether it is or not. I cannot say. But it has been very thoroughly sundried after being steamed and is shrunk to its smallest contraction.
Kountze—Now, Mr. Mulhall stated that that lumber in water, as it would be placed in the lagoon, the life of it would be only two or three years. Have you any experience with lumber of that class under those conditions?
Geraldine—Yes, sir; I have handled yellow pine lumber and used it in engineering works for a great many years, used it as long as twenty years. This lumber placed in that lagoon as it is now will last for ten years in the water. It will last longer. There was a prejudice, and there is yet a prejudice against the use of yellow pine in this country, which was promulgated and encouraged by those interested in the sale of white pine, and it only came into this trade when white pine became so scarce as to give it the advantage. Being used more and more every year, that prejudice is fast disappearing.
Rosewater—I want to ask Mr. Wakefield, as he is an old lumberman and understands, I want to ask him whether this sized lumber is what is classed as three-inch measure lumber. It has been stated here that this lumber originally was 3¼ inches; that it has been ordered as such and delivered as such, but it is now 2¾ inches. Now, what do you know as to the probable shrinking and planking?
Wakefield—I have no means of knowing what it originally was, but if it is 2¾ inches it need not have been over 3 inches to dress 2¾. But if 3-inch lumber were ordered without any further designation, that is to say, 3-inch lumber, dressed on one side, then it would come 2 5-8 thick, because 2-inch lumber comes 1 5-8 and 3-inch lumber would come 2 5-8.
Geraldine—After what kind of a drying process?
Wakefield—Either air drying or steam drying.
Geraldine—Did you ever handle any steam dried?
Wakefield—Yes, sir.
Geraldine—And was it thoroughly dried?
Wakefield—Yes, sir.
Geraldine—What did you find the shrinkage to be in a three-inch plank?
Wakefield—I could not say, because I did not handle it until after it was dried and dressed, and then it came to me. Then, I say, a two-inch plank, as it comes to this market, after being dried and then dressed, measures one and five-eighths inches.
Geraldine—Shrinks three-eighths of an inch.
Wakefield—Three-eighths. Whether it shrinks or it is the dressing I cannot say.
Geraldine—That is two-inch.
Wakefield—Yes, sir. If you would order a three-inch plank dressed one side without further designation than just that order you would not get it thicker than two and five-eighths inches. If it had to be a special thickness it would have to be so specified.
Geraldine—On three inches there would be a greater shrinkage than on two inches, and you say—
Wakefield—I don't say anything about shrinkage. I say what two-inch lumber is in this market or what three-inch lumber will be in this market.
Geraldine—Is the ordinary stock lumber that comes from the south dried by steam before shipping?
Wakefield—Most of it is either air dried or steam dried. You would not on a special order, as this would be, ordering a lot of specially cut stuff to be shipped in a specially short time, it would not permit of the drying process to a sufficient extent to get the shrinkage out of it.
ON DRYING LUMBER.
Geraldine—How long would it take to thoroughly dry it by steam?
Wakefield—By steam? Well, it would not take so long by steam. you can dry it by steam in twenty-four to thirty-six hours of you have the proper process. A three-inch plank it would take five days.
Geraldine—I wish to state of this lumber, that there was not any of it in the kiln less than two weeks. Ten days was first decided the manufacturers time but they kept it in for that length of time. I wish to explain something about steam drying. You can take yellow pine lumber as it comes from the mill, put it in a southern steam drier and dry it so severely as to greatly deteriorate its strength. You can dry it rapidly or dry it slowly by steam. By drying it slowly and thoroughly you maintain the strength, don't destroy the fiber, but you give it greater strength. That was what I called for in this case.
Wakefield—That statement is correct.
Kountze—Have you any knowledge, Mr. Wakefield, of the life of yellow pine lumber in washed earth and in water?
Wakefield—Some little. My experience has not been very extensive.
Kountze—What would be your judgment of a piece of yellow pine lumber, dried as that is, in water?
Wakefield—In water it will last twelve or fifteen years, at least. The place where it would decay the quickest in my judgment would be, if the water was kept at a certain stationary height, at that point and higher up is where it would decay the quickest; not under the water.
Kountze—What would be the difference in time it would be likely to decay between the green pine, not dried, and dried pine? Which would decay the quickest?
Wakefield—There would not be any difference about that.
Kountze—One would decay as soon as the other?
Wakefield—I think so. I don't think there would be any difference about that. But if you were going to make a tight piling, of course it is better to have it dry when it is put in, because then the absorption of the water and the consequential swelling would make it perfectly tight and keep it tight. Whereas, if it was full of water when it was put in there would be no room for swelling to make the joints swell tight and remain tight.
Wells—In your judgment, should that groove have been cemented?
Wakefield—Now, Mr. Wells, that is a question in practical politics that I don't feel competent to testify on.
Geraldine—I would like to furnish an explanation. On the west end of the lagoon there is a variety of soils and substratums. At the extreme west end I found the soil black to a great depth, in fact, we never got to the bottom of the black soil, and near the bottom we found a composition where it was turning into black gumbo. Further up, at the east side of the basin, we found there had been a heavy fill made in some places and a variety of conditions. I was doubtful to some extent as to whether I could make that soil hold water or not, and I therefore desired in putting in the piling to make that watertight if possible. For that reason I specified paint in the tongues and grooves.
Wells—At the west end?
Geraldine—I specified it in the contract without reference to how far it should go. I was disposed, if I found it necessary, to use it the whole length. Took more pains to drive the sheet piling at the west end closely together and to use nothing but what was as near perfect as possible, and to see that the joints were well painted. I did not succeed in that very well—as well as I expected. The idea of putting paint or white lead between the joints is to pull them close enough together so they do not separate at all and glue them—cause them to adhere to one another. Now, my idea in that was to get that work done as quickly as I possibly could, get the water in it as quickly thereafter as possible and start those planks swelling by the action of the water as soon as I possibly could. I was defeated in that by several causes. The railroad construction was interrupted and the lumber failed to arrive that was expected. We had to stop work on this sheet piling many times to wait for lumber, which the Cady Lumber Company was trying hard to get up here, but was defeated in delivering owing to the famine of cars. Now, when we got out of that part of the work and further up the lagoon, fully one-half the distance, lineal feet, I found that the clay that we were puddling and packing hard behind the sheet piling, it was satisfactory to me—it was watertight. I saw no further use for using the lead or paint, because it did not seem to effect the purpose I was after, and I did not think it would be necessary. So I discontinued the use of the paint.
KOUNTZE TELLS OF THE SOIL.
Kountze—I will explain here in regard to the soil, having owned that property for a long while, that when I first knew that territory up there the west end of the lagoon was a swamp, commonly known as a slough, and at times was entirely immpassable; could not drive through it. As you went further east it was at a greater elevation and the soil was good. About the time of platting Kountze Place I graded a good many of the streets and the surplus earth that I had was filled about half way between Twentieth street and Twenty-fourth street, and that accounts for that loose earth that you encountered going through there.
Geraldine—Yes, to counteract that effect I had pure clay drawn by wagons and strung along the lagoon to fill in back of the piles and tamped.
Rosewater—The specifications call that white lead shall be liberally applied to the tongue and groove joints before driving. Now, you stated that it had been omitted in the actual work to a considerable extent. To what extent has it been omitted or what proportion of it?
Geraldine—Approximately one half.
Rosewater—Was there any reduction made for the white lead and the work from the contract price?
Geraldine—We settled at the contract price. In the construction of this work the contractor was required to do more than the contract calls for. The exposition company was responsible for the delivery of the lumber and the contractor was obliged to stop several times to wait for it. At the east end of the work the foreman for the contractor put the waling and caps on the sheet piling that was driven against the back walls and terraces. It now stands there. It was not a part of the contract. The contractor had several claims of that kind which were discussed and considered and finally agreed to settle the matter by settling at the contract price. I deducted nothing for the omission of the paint and he received nothing for the extra work that his men did or the expensive delay caused by our failure to deliver the lumber.
Rosewater—Were these facts reported to the executive committee or to Mr. Kirkendall?
Geraldine—No, sir, they were discussed verbally with Mr. Wattles, who was acting manager of the department at that time, but no written report was made.
Rosewater—I want to call Mr. Connolly.
Rosewater—You were one of the bidders for the work on the lagoon?
Connolly—Yes, sir, I was one of the bidders.
Rosewater—And you submitted a bid under the first advertisement for the lagoon?
Connolly—Yes, sir.
Rosewater—And that bid, with all the others, was rejected.
Connolly—Yes, sir. That is, I was told it was rejected.
Rosewater—After your first bid was rejected did Mr. Geraldine ask you to make a revised bid, and on what conditions?
Connolly—Yes, sir; he did. I called on Mr. Geraldine, I believe it was the following day, or probably the second day, to ascertain who was the low bidder on this work, and he told me at that time that I was not. He said for me to make up another bid, and he asked me for a bid on what I would do to provide all the labor for driving the piles and sheet piling, provided that the exposition company would furnish the materials. He also asked me at that time to make another bid, to bid in another way. That is, the same way really, only instead of driving the sheet pile two feet six inches in depth, to dig a trench around the lagoon and set the piling, the sheet piling, into this trench and drive them six inches. Instead of two feet six inches, just drive them six inches, and what my figures would be on that basis. I did that. So he also asked me at that time to make a bid between the difference in yellow pine and white pine. I told him then I did not think I could give him a bid on yellow pine, for the simple reason that I could not get any figures from the lumber dealers to guarantee to me that they would deliver the lumber by September 10. I told him if I was not pinned down to the 10th day of September then I thought I could give him a reasonable figure. But he warned me at that time to do nothing unless I could stand by it, and I concluded I would not do that, because the lumber people claimed they could not get it here. I put a bid in on it that was probably a little high, but I could not furnish the lumber at that figure.
NO TALK OF CHANGES.
Rosewater—If you had been given to the 20th day of September could you have done that work?
Connolly—Yes, sir; I could. One week was all I wanted on the yellow pine and on the white pine there was no question about doing the labor in that time, because I had lots of time and time to spare.
Rosewater—When you made your second bid did you complete your bid and make your estimates on the original plans and specifications, excepting so far as you have stated here in relation to the depth to which the sheet piling was to be driven?
Connolly—Yes, sir. There was no other plans or specifications to bid from at that time, only the original, only just this verbal conversation that Mr. Geraldine and I had about digging a trench. That was the only difference at that time. There was no difference in the specifications or plans.
Kountze—There were no other modifications at this time between you and Mr. Geraldine than simply the question of digging the trench and setting the sheet piling instead of driving it?
Connolly—No, sir; there were no other modifications of the contract considered or spoken of. Not at that time nor any other time. The only difference was that originally the sheet piling was to be driven two feet and six inches and in this a trench was to be dug and the piles were to be driven six inches—set in the trench and driven six inches.
Kountze—There was nothing said about any other changes, nothing said about using yellow pine, nothing said about the manner of tying the piling back with wire, as was done?
Connolly—No, sir; no indeed.
Kountze—No drawing to show?
Connolly—No drawing. No sir; I will tell you when I found that out. The plans were identically as drawn at that time.
Kountze—Being no difference whateevr, excepting as to the matter of the trench?
Connolly—Yes, sir; just the trench. The only difference was in driving the piling, or in setting in the trench and then driving six inches.
Kountze—And your bid in the second instance was for setting the piles in the trench as indicated by Mr. Geraldine, and driving them six inches?
Connolly—Yes, sir. There was both ways. I bid to do the work according to the plans and specifications as originally drawn, and also on that bid, then put in another bid, really as one bid, stating that if allowed to dig this trench and set the piles in there and drive them six inches, that I would knock off $700.
Kountze—Are you quite sure, now, that your bid provided for that?
Connolly—Am I sure? Yes, sir.
Kountze—For the driving of the piles six inches?
Connolly—Well, now, as far as driving the piles I don't know. Probably it was not in the bid, but that was the instruction that Mr. Geraldine gave me, and according to that instruction I bid. If it is not in there it was meant for that. There was no way to get out of it at all. That was the instruction very explicitly laid down by Mr. Geraldine.
Kountze—It does not appear in your bid.
Connolly—It doesn't? Well, that was the intent of the bid. The object was in driving them six inches; there is a bevel on the piling so that when you drive it this bevel will wedge it up against the next pile as it comes into the ground.
Kountze—Your bid explicitly provides that it was not driven. If sheet piling is allowed to be set in the trench instead of being driven, deduct $700.
Connolly—Instead of being driven two feet and six inches.
Kountze—You don't so explain it in the bid.
Connolly—The plans and specifications do. I bid from the plans and specifications. My bid reads, I believe, "according to plans and specifications," and the plans and specifications provide for that.
PROVISIONS OF THE BID.
Rosewater—Did you have at any time when you were making out your bid, or after delivering it, any information that there would be any change made in the plans and specifications over those in the plans on which you bid $7,100?
Connolly—No, sir. I had no indication whatever, or any idea, that there would be any change made.
Rosewater—Your bid for labor as you made it included all the labor and included also the driving of the piles, did it not?
Connolly—My bid provided for driving the mainstay piles, driving the sheet piling, driving the backstay piles and performing all the labor that was attached to the job complete. And my bid for the labor, if the sheet piling was driven two feet and six inches, if I recollect it right, my bid was $2,800. But if the sheet piling was allowed to be set in a trench, which was to be excavated two feet, and driven six inches, then my price on the labor was $2,100, making a difference in that trench of $700 for labor for me.
Kountze—Mr. Connolly, you have a foot note here in your bid. Will you please explain it? You say, the timber to be delivered to me on railroad in the exposition grounds?
Connolly—Providing that the exposition would furnish me the material I would perform the labor and they were to deliver the timber to me on the ground. If I was to do the labor and not furnish the material, then I wanted the lumber delivered to me there, but if I had got the contract for furnishing the labor and lumber then I would have to provide my own material. But that provides that if the exposition company would award me the contract for performing the labor I would expect them to furnish the lumber to me at the track at the grounds.
Bidwell—That foot note, then, applies to your bid for $2,800 and not to your bid of $7,800?
Connolly—That is all. To the $2,800 and the $2,100. Just for the labor.
Kountze—Was the question of the trench determined at the time that you made this bid? That is, that it should be only a foot in depth and six inches driven, or was that done after?
Connolly—No, at no time. The only difference was, Mr. Geraldine told me the day I was in his office that if he allowed a trench to be excavated two feet in depth what deduction will you make from your original bid? That was all. He told me to make a bid on that basis, that we dig a trench two feet deep and set our sheet piling in there and drive them six inches, to keep them solid and fast at the bottom; that is all.
Rosewater—If you had been allowed to furnish white pine on the specifications as they were executed out here, could you have made any material deduction from the price that you did make? You know what has been done out there?
Connolly—Yes, sir.
Rosewater—And you know what the difference is between the work as done now by Creedon & Mahoney and the way you were bidding? If you had been allowed to bid for the work as it is now done, have you any idea what difference it would be in value and what deduction you would have made from your original bid?
Connolly—Well, now, I could figure it up in a moment. I would say (this is not as near as I could give it exactly) that I could have made $700 difference.
Rosewater—Seven hundred dollars difference in what? In the price you quoted the second time or the first time? You made the total amount of work and total amount of material at $7,900 in white pine on your first bid. Now, you mean you would have done it for $7,200 with white pine, the way it stands there now?
Connolly—Yes, sir, I do. Yes, sir, I believe even I could go lower than that. I tell you, gentleman, I would have been glad to deduct $18 a thousand for every thousand feet of lumber that was saved on that job, and still I would have a profit left. My bid was on white pine of the first quality, which cannot be bought for less than $18 per thousand.
Bidwell—Now, do you know?
Connolly—Well, I cannot buy it. I bid according to the figures that were quoted to me, that's all.
Rosewater—First quality, you mean?
Connolly—No. 1; yes, sir.
Rosewater—Now, let me ask you this. If you had been offered this lumber for the work as now done at $14.50 per 1,000, how much reduction would you have made from your bid?
WOULD HAVE BID LOWER.
Connolly—You say if I was offered the lumber at $14.50? Well, the difference between $14.50 and $1
